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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2010 7:10:21 GMT -5
i dont know what it will take to open eyes....or should i say minds..and let the daylight and the reality strike home....but eventuallly it will become clear exactly which road we have blundered into.....and it will not be a happy or a smooth road..especially for women freedom will have to be fought for all over again...and all so un-necessary... i think what really irks me is the fact that those who will have enabled this down grading of women and society will not be the ones paying the price,,they will not have to answer for their sheer blindness.... the very fact that this man can come out with this and NOT face a barrage of condemnation tells me we are pretty far down the road already...its later than we think ......evil thrives when good men do nothing... How would you define 'a barrage of condemnation?' I've seen in the past how Muslims HAVE stood up against the liars and heretics who come out with nonsense of this type and yet CONTINUE to be lumped in the same grab-bag as those who DO. A MILLION Turks marched AGAINST religious fundamentalism. In Britain thousands of Muslims took part in the 'Not in Our Name' demonstrations against Muslim fundamentalism. Even if Muslims DO condemn extremism there is as much chance of those who are prejudiced against them beyond ANY degree of rationality recognising that fact as there is of the Ku Klux Klan choosing a black man as their Imperial Wizard! My eyes ARE open; it is the eyes of the PREJUDICED that are wilfuly closed! |
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Post by mouse on Oct 16, 2010 7:10:34 GMT -5
an islamophobe has an irational fear...so the word of islophobe is not warrented..as there is nothing irational about anything which fret has writen and the man is neither predudiced nor intolorant...he is a minister of the islamic religion...he is a follower of islam...and he is doing his job......it is islam not the man that is the problem |
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Post by fretslider on Oct 16, 2010 7:11:54 GMT -5
? I didn't mention gender, I mentioned the law - rape is against the law, period. This one clown is the senior Muslim cleric in charge of Britain’s largest group of sharia law courts. The faith you have sought to defend doesn't look that defensible now, does it. Dear Fret I wish you would STOP trying to distort my position. I do NOT and never HAVE 'defended' Ialam or indeed any OTHER faith. I do however object strenously to prejudice and intolerance. This idiot IS prejudiced and intolerant. So are Islamophobes. It's ironic that nearly ALL the objections to Muslims are the SAME ones that were made to Jews a hundred years ago or even less. Many of them are STILL being recycled AS anti-Jewish ones in Russia where anti-Semitism is rife. Many incompetent or bad people get into positions of power and/or influence. This clown is simply yet one more. You are trying to tar ALL Muslims with the SAME brush and it is as irrational as claiming that, for instance, because MOST muggings are carried out by blacks that therefore MOST blacks are muggers. Please do NOT try to impute to me views which I do NOT hold and which I have NEVER held. Thank you. But this idiot is in a position of authority and his words carry weight - in sharia courts. Its not a question of competence, its a matter of interpreting religious texts. All good muslims must follow the teachings of the Qu'ran, ergo they all follow Allah and what Allah says, goes. Jews, blacks and muggings have nothing to do with it, yet another red herring thrown in. The law as stated by Sayeed is a husband may rape his wife and go unpunished. Do Jews and blacks have a law like that? |
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Post by mouse on Oct 16, 2010 7:14:48 GMT -5
it wont change mike untill muslims actually look and change and clamour and insist on change...and they are not yet putting heads above parapets...they will have to be a great deal more forcefull.....for they say they ar e one ummah....so no passing the buck...the answer is in their hands
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2010 7:15:58 GMT -5
an islamophobe has an irational fear...so the word of islophobe is not warrented..as there is nothing irational about anything which fret has writen and the man is neither predudiced nor intolorant...he is a minister of the islamic religion...he is a follower of islam...and he is doing his job......it is islam not the man that is the problem How RATIONAL is ANY kind of fear, Mouse? Is it MORE rational to worry if your house catches fire and you can see it burning or to worry about the fact that a minority of idiots put forward opinions which you don't share. Fret's post, like your own, is FULL of irrational prejudice and blind hatred. As what he says is NOT in accordance with Islam, the man IS a liar and a heretic. Now please STOP pretending that your PREJUDICES are FACTS and please STOP accusing ME of BEING some kind of supporter of Islam. I am a supporter of TOLERANCE, FREEDOM AND COMPASSION. This man is not. Anyone who would DEFEND rape under ANY circumstances is just sick. Believe me, there are PLENTY of atheists who commit rape. |
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Post by fretslider on Oct 16, 2010 7:18:14 GMT -5
"Fret's post, like your own, is FULL of irrational prejudice and blind hatred."
Sheikh Maulana Abu Sayeed, the senior Muslim cleric in charge of Britain’s largest group of sharia law courts, has decreed that there is no such thing as rape within marriage.
What?
Sayeed said that sex without a wife’s consent was “not good” but it could not be called rape. Rape within marriage has been illegal in Britain since 1991. But according to Sayeed, rape is defined in Islamic law as adultery by force. Therefore, if a husband forces himself upon his wife the attack cannot be termed “rape”.
Sayeed, it should be remembered, demands that all Western/Christian men should not be allowed to see the face or body shape of his women, yet its ok for muslim husbands to rape them.
How many women here agree with Sayeed?
Does Beez, I wonder?
Dave Whatton, Chief Constable of Cheshire and spokesman on rape for the Association of Chief Police Officers, said most rapes were committed by someone known to or in a relationship with the victim. “It is a fundamental principle that sharia law should not replace the laws of the UK,” he said. “Putting out views that rape can be dealt with in another way fundamentally undermines everything we are trying to do.”
And that is exactly what they are trying to do. Islam cannot exist under our system of one law for all. Perhaps this outburst will destroy once and for all the foolish notion that opposition to the creeping islamification of Britain can only be motivated by bigotry and prejudice.
Please indicate where it is FULL of irrational prejudice and blind hatred.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2010 7:18:16 GMT -5
Dear Fret I wish you would STOP trying to distort my position. I do NOT and never HAVE 'defended' Ialam or indeed any OTHER faith. I do however object strenously to prejudice and intolerance. This idiot IS prejudiced and intolerant. So are Islamophobes. It's ironic that nearly ALL the objections to Muslims are the SAME ones that were made to Jews a hundred years ago or even less. Many of them are STILL being recycled AS anti-Jewish ones in Russia where anti-Semitism is rife. Many incompetent or bad people get into positions of power and/or influence. This clown is simply yet one more. You are trying to tar ALL Muslims with the SAME brush and it is as irrational as claiming that, for instance, because MOST muggings are carried out by blacks that therefore MOST blacks are muggers. Please do NOT try to impute to me views which I do NOT hold and which I have NEVER held. Thank you. But this idiot is in a position of authority and his words carry weight - in sharia courts. Its not a question of competence, its a matter of interpreting religious texts. All good muslims must follow the teachings of the Qu'ran, ergo they all follow Allah and what Allah says, goes. Jews, blacks and muggings have nothing to do with it, yet another red herring thrown in. The law as stated by Sayeed is a husband may rape his wife and go unpunished. Do Jews and blacks have a law like that? Dear Fret Do you or do you NOT regard me as supporting Islam? As I have told you REPEATEDLY that I do NOT, will you please STOP trying to pretend that I AM? Orthodox Jews believe that women should be stoned to death for adultery. They also believe that the husband may use violence towards his wife in marriage. You don't seem so keen to condemn them - why not? Hypocriisy, perhaps? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2010 7:18:57 GMT -5
Incidentally, the Quran does NOT support rape so the guy is just a sick liar.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2010 7:19:52 GMT -5
it wont change mike untill muslims actually look and change and clamour and insist on change...and they are not yet putting heads above parapets...they will have to be a great deal more forcefull.....for they say they ar e one ummah....so no passing the buck...the answer is in their hands Yes they ARE Mouse. It is YOU who have YOUR eyes closed to the reality of that fact. |
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Post by fretslider on Oct 16, 2010 7:21:17 GMT -5
Incidentally, the Quran does NOT support rape so the guy is just a sick liar. Oh dear Mike. Religious texts are interpreted and you choose to interpret them in your western way. He has laid down the law and it will be followed. |
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Post by fretslider on Oct 16, 2010 7:24:22 GMT -5
But this idiot is in a position of authority and his words carry weight - in sharia courts. Its not a question of competence, its a matter of interpreting religious texts. All good muslims must follow the teachings of the Qu'ran, ergo they all follow Allah and what Allah says, goes. Jews, blacks and muggings have nothing to do with it, yet another red herring thrown in. The law as stated by Sayeed is a husband may rape his wife and go unpunished. Do Jews and blacks have a law like that? Dear Fret Do you or do you NOT regard me as supporting Islam? As I have told you REPEATEDLY that I do NOT, will you please STOP trying to pretend that I AM? Orthodox Jews believe that women should be stoned to death for adultery. They also believe that the husband may use violence towards his wife in marriage. You don't seem so keen to condemn them - why not? Hypocriisy, perhaps? I read your apologias for Islam. In this case you accuse Sayeed of being a sick liar, but that doesn't wash, Mike. When did the Jews last stone an adulterer to death? Give it up with the pointless red herrings and accept the fact that Islam is incompatible with our values and way of life. |
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Post by fretslider on Oct 16, 2010 7:34:03 GMT -5
For the record...
Stoning is practiced in Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, Nigeria, Pakistan and Iran - all follow the religion of peace.
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Post by mouse on Oct 16, 2010 7:38:55 GMT -5
Incidentally, the Quran does NOT support rape so the guy is just a sick liar. but the prophet did defend rape....so that leaves us with rape defended,,condoned and sanctioned sex with what your hand
pocesses...the word in its self is an indication of exactly where islam is on this subject..to say nothing of custom and practise
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Post by mouse on Oct 16, 2010 7:47:26 GMT -5
fear is rational when the fear is likely to transform into actuality..we are not talking fear of spiders or clowns here...but a set of laws...writ down enforceable laws where sharia is in control and ugly in its control of course there are plenty of athiests who comit rape...and your point is..what  as we are not talking about athiests.. i dont doubt for one moment you think you are tollorant..nor do i doubt you think your self a suporter of freedoms and compassion but some of the things you say put a question mark on your abilklity to aknowledge the freedoms and tollorance toward others to dispute your held belifes and bringing in irelevencies gains us nothing |
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Post by fretslider on Oct 16, 2010 7:50:33 GMT -5
fear is rational when the fear is likely to transform into actuality..we are not talking fear of spiders or clowns here...but a set of laws...writ down enforceable laws where sharia is in control and ugly in its control of course there are plenty of athiests who comit rape...and your point is..what as we are not talking about athiests.. i dont doubt for one moment you think you are tollorant..nor do i doubt you think your self a suporter of freedoms and compassion but some of the things you say put a question mark on your abilklity to aknowledge the freedoms and tollorance toward others to dispute your held belifes and bringing in irelevencies gains us nothing If an atheist husband rapes his wife British law applies. |
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Alpha 
as we are not talking about athiests..