|
|
Post by Soulman on Jun 1, 2011 15:04:03 GMT -5
Just to say that these details were not put out because of the severity. Unfortunately the Bulger parents have to live with this information every day. The witholding of pertinent info may have contributed to the publics lack of outcry, especially after Venables was caught with illegal child porn. To their credit, they seem to have corrected this oversight. Little doubt that he will strike again...I can only hope that the next time, he will be swiftly caught & properly imprisoned for life. I'd be willing to bet, the Bulger's have known very well, since their child was found, what happened to him...in detail. Yes they have, and sickening sexual abuse, re the coroners report, i hope they did not actually witness close up the abuse. |
|
|
|
Post by biglin on Jun 1, 2011 15:25:24 GMT -5
So it makes even less sense protecting Venables.
Just turn him loose in Liverpool and see how long he lasts!
Grrr!
|
|
|
|
Post by Soulman on Jun 1, 2011 15:37:12 GMT -5
So it makes even less sense protecting Venables. Just turn him loose in Liverpool and see how long he lasts! Grrr! I totally agree  ....and sod his human rights....in my opinion. |
|
|
|
Post by biglin on Jun 1, 2011 15:46:46 GMT -5
I believe in citizens' justice - especially with scum like Venables!
|
|
Erasmus
Moderatorz 
Deep Thought Mod
"We do not take prisoners - we liberate them" - http://www.aeonbytegnosticradio.com
Posts: 2,489
|
Post by Erasmus on Jun 1, 2011 17:36:13 GMT -5
But why is he a problem when Thompson is not? I don't believe in mob murder of children. It is no different from burning them at the stake for witchcraft. The reason there is a justice system, and has been one of some sort for as long as there has been known history, is to prevent the populace in general from becoming no different from the criminals they deplore.
|
|
|
|
Post by mouse on Jun 2, 2011 2:37:49 GMT -5
for once i agree[loosely] with erasmus..[and yes i am aware of the sexual abuse of james bulger] the two boys both had horrendous backgrounds via their parents and siblings...yet neither the patrents or siblings were punished for their parts of what their boys became and the state had care and control of them after the killing of james and has in venables case..apears to have failed miserably venables should never have been put back on the streets and its the states failing which has allowed this i never could understand the agression meted out to thompson and venables at the time when they were 10 yrs old.... i abhore what they did to james but equally i abhore what was done to these boys and i have very real concerns about the way their punishment/rehabilitation was handled ..inadequate to say the least |
|
arizonavet
Journeyman
Protect the Innocent & Drink Belgian Ale
Posts: 351
|
Post by arizonavet on Jun 2, 2011 7:33:56 GMT -5
But why is he a problem when Thompson is not? I don't believe in mob murder of children. It is no different from burning them at the stake for witchcraft. The reason there is a justice system, and has been one of some sort for as long as there has been known history, is to prevent the populace in general from becoming no different from the criminals they deplore. Who ever said "Thompson is not a problem"? It's just that Venebles has THREE big "strikes" (baseball talk to the initiated) against him. He kidnapped a 2 year old boy. He sexually abused the 2 year old boy. He killed the 2 year old boy. He is participating in child porn....over 14 years later! OK, so I can't count. Good question concerning Thompson.....I assume he's out, looking for a new child-rich opportunity where the parents have no idea he's prowling....any word on him? |
|
|
|
Post by trubble on Jun 2, 2011 13:30:33 GMT -5
It was the outcry that made the government of the day impose a harsher sentence than the court had given, and that was subsequently deemed unlawful.
There couldn't have been more outcry.
|
|
Erasmus
Moderatorz
Deep Thought Mod
"We do not take prisoners - we liberate them" - http://www.aeonbytegnosticradio.com
Posts: 2,489
|
Post by Erasmus on Jun 2, 2011 14:16:47 GMT -5
Good question concerning Thompson.....I assume he's out, looking for a new child-rich opportunity where the parents have no idea he's prowling....any word on him? Why do you assume that? Do you believe that punishment and treatment are always a waste of time? |
|
arizonavet
Journeyman
Protect the Innocent & Drink Belgian Ale
Posts: 351
|
Post by arizonavet on Jun 2, 2011 14:27:34 GMT -5
It was the outcry that made the government of the day impose a harsher sentence than the court had given, and that was subsequently deemed unlawful. There couldn't have been more outcry. Good to hear! I was referring to attempting to place them within communities, when the communities didn't know all the details, which clearly indicated child abuse. Also, did the local constabulary know that they had a child molestor, as well as a murderer to keep observation on? Perhaps they did, they caught him somehow. Now you've got me curious....what punishment could have been lighter than releasing them after eight years? *********************************************************************************************** In June 2001, after a six-month review, the parole board ruled the boys were no longer a threat to public safety and could be released as their minimum tariff had expired in the February of that year. The Home Secretary David Blunkett approved the decision, and they were released a few weeks later on a lifelong licence after serving eight years. Wikipedia...source ************************************************************************************************ They were on "lifeling licence".....I assume that would be the equivilent of parole in the USA,....... OK fine.....if Venables is found guilty of child porn...a crime specifically connected with the rape/murder of this 2 year old boy..... do you think there is any chance he'll go back & spend the rest of his life in prison? Does the UK assign GPS anklets to these child rapists? |
|
|
|
Post by Soulman on Jun 2, 2011 16:22:25 GMT -5
But why is he a problem when Thompson is not? I don't believe in mob murder of children. It is no different from burning them at the stake for witchcraft. The reason there is a justice system, and has been one of some sort for as long as there has been known history, is to prevent the populace in general from becoming no different from the criminals they deplore. Thompson may be a problem, who knows. Venables got away with things for years, duped the social/probation bods (not that hard really considering other developments) but finaly got caught. |
|
arizonavet
Journeyman
Protect the Innocent & Drink Belgian Ale
Posts: 351
|
Post by arizonavet on Jun 7, 2011 8:26:32 GMT -5
Good question concerning Thompson.....I assume he's out, looking for a new child-rich opportunity where the parents have no idea he's prowling....any word on him? Why do you assume that? Do you believe that punishment and treatment are always a waste of time? When talking about human behavior, the word "always" simply does not apply. The rate of recitivism for child molestors is horrible....changing their despicable ways are (nearly) a waste of time & money (IMHO).... I would put a GPS anklet on a child molestor the FIRST time he is found guilty, and he would carry it to his grave...no matter what. Second time he's found guilty....I'd execute him. When Venables was found with child porn, after raping & murdering a 2 year old boy.....he should have been immediatly put in "solitary".... Is there a doubt in ANYBODY's mind what will happen if he is allowed to "mingle" in public? You must assume that you cannot "reform" a stick of dynomite. |
|
|
|
Post by trubble on Jun 7, 2011 10:44:23 GMT -5
It's new territory. No, I don't think Venables is ''reformed'', I don't even think the authorities have worked out what to reform. It doesn't seem to me that anyone understands why he and Thompson did what they did. But -- unless someone can show me otherwise? -- Thompson appears to be able to live normally without causing problems to anyone. As does Mary Bell. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_BellI think it was too early to release them but when you're dealing with a child who kills I suppose everything is somewhat a case of guesstimation. If they looked at Mary Bell as a precedent, they could make a case for release being more beneficial than moving the two boys to an adult prison, where they would have to assume false identities, and where they would now be learning more about criminal behaviour than about normal behaviour. And how would that stop him downloading illegal porn and child abuse images? Well, whatever else (imprisoned, solitary, whatever) he certainly should be under the care of a dedicated team of pyschologists who can a) try to work out what the hell is going on and b) help him. Venables' second crime is not the same as his first crime. Would you execute a child, by the way? Mary Bell committed two murders. One when she was 10 and one when she was 11. |
|
arizonavet
Journeyman
Protect the Innocent & Drink Belgian Ale
Posts: 351
|
Post by arizonavet on Jun 7, 2011 11:25:17 GMT -5
It's new territory. No, I don't think Venables is ''reformed'', I don't even think the authorities have worked out what to reform. It doesn't seem to me that anyone understands why he and Thompson did what they did. But -- unless someone can show me otherwise? -- Thompson appears to be able to live normally without causing problems to anyone. As does Mary Bell. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_BellI think it was too early to release them but when you're dealing with a child who kills I suppose everything is somewhat a case of guesstimation. If they looked at Mary Bell as a precedent, they could make a case for release being more beneficial than moving the two boys to an adult prison, where they would have to assume false identities, and where they would now be learning more about criminal behaviour than about normal behaviour. And how would that stop him downloading illegal porn and child abuse images? Well, whatever else (imprisoned, solitary, whatever) he certainly should be under the care of a dedicated team of pyschologists who can a) try to work out what the hell is going on and b) help him. Venables' second crime is not the same as his first crime. Would you execute a child, by the way? Mary Bell committed two murders. One when she was 10 and one when she was 11. No, I certainly wouldn't execute a 10 year old....but one who sexually assaults, then bashes the head in of a 2 year old.....and is now over 20 years old & still (illegally)into "kiddy-porn".... I'd do a whole lot more than turn him over to a shrink.....that's for sure. Mary Bell? ANYONE who wouldn't want this sick puppy watched & watched closely, is sadly deluded. If she was spotted downloading kiddy-porn, specifically where a child was being sexually disfigured (as she did to 3 year old Brian Howe).....she should be incarcerated for life... |
|
|
|
Post by trubble on Jun 7, 2011 12:32:48 GMT -5
The thing is, she appears to be living a crime free, incident free, kiddy-killing free, life. If she did it, why shouldn't the same system be suitable for Thompson and Venables? (Literally the same system, she was held in the same place apparently).
So there's the reasoning for thinking it was okay to release the two young men. And one of them (like Mary Bell, who is now a grandmother) has gone on to form a family and appears to be 'rehabiliated' or at least not a danger to anyone.
And one of them is obviously not okay.
But his second crime, as loathsome as it may be, is hardly comparable to his first; so to execute for that second crime seems almost arbitrary, the second crime not being one that ever carries a life sentence. Vengeful instead of rational? ?
|
|
....and sod his human rights....in my opinion.
