ladylinda
Moderatorz
Poetry Editor
July 2011 Member of the Month, May 2014 Member of the Month
Posts: 4,901
|
SOUL
Jan 24, 2017 15:05:57 GMT -5
Post by ladylinda on Jan 24, 2017 15:05:57 GMT -5
Chefmate, I went to the link you posted (thanks for posting it). It also had a thread in which it made it quite plain that you do NOT have to believe in the inerrancy of the Bible to be saved. And the article you posted the link to is very short - just a series of statements without much justification. How can God make errors of fact, approve of rape and murder and genocide for example (which the various HUMAN authors of the Bible claim that He does?) if the Bible is 'inerrant' since the Bible clearly forbids murder and rape? How can God support stoning adulterers to death when even the Quran only prescribes a flogging for that? And so on and so on. Human wisdom is fallible and 'errant.' The Bible was NOT written by God but written by HUMANS so by definition it CAN'T be 'inerrant' or 'infallible' since HUMANS wrote it. I agree salvation is not dependant on knowing any scripture, but, after one has had the regeneration by the Holy Spirit, born again, and not through infant baptism, adult baptism or catechism, the true believer knows all scripture is God breathed. A Muslim fundamentalist would say the same about the Quran. So would an Orthodox Jew about the Old Testament and the Talmud. Let's try and put ourselves in the shoes of non-believers. How can you try to persuade them? Let's face it, missionaries must have this problem and they still manage to convert people. So how do they persuade non-believers to convert?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
SOUL
Jan 24, 2017 22:44:14 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 22:44:14 GMT -5
all we would accomplish is butting heads. I can pull up scripture to back me up so what's the point? I'm on strong ground with my faith, but as I said, butting heads is a waste of time. On top of that, you don't believe the bible was inspired by God through men and is inerrant word of God; as to gender, God specifically assigned roles to each gender and women are not eligible to be pastors, deacons or hold authority in the church over men. Hi Chefmate51, You have quoted verses that contradicts what is happening. Strange things happen in life that are not ordinary happenings, like the shining figure that appeared in my lounge and saw quite clearly. According to you that is of Satan, yet when something strange happens when Jesus is involved, even though it is said that you cannot speak with the dead, you don't believe that is also of the Devil.Something is wrong somewhere!!! I will try to explain. Jesus was without sin which is why He was the only one who could pay our penalty and take the wrath of God that was meant for us: Revelation 21:8 “But cowards, unbelievers, the corrupt, murderers, the immoral, those who practice witchcraft, idol worshipers, and all liars–their fate is in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.” Galatians 5:19-21 Now the actions of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, promiscuity, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, rivalry, jealously, outbursts of anger, quarrels, conflicts, factions, envy, murder, drunkenness, wild partying, and things like that. I am telling you now, as I have told you in the past, that people who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. Now keep in mind, the perfection and sinlessness of Jesus. He could not be talking to two men that were reincarnated when His own word expressly forbids contacting spirits. God is incapable of lying or sinning. While this event took place, God the Father spoke these words... 'This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear him!' Again, God cannot lie and would not endorse reincarnation in any way, shape or form.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
SOUL
Jan 24, 2017 22:52:10 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 22:52:10 GMT -5
I agree salvation is not dependant on knowing any scripture, but, after one has had the regeneration by the Holy Spirit, born again, and not through infant baptism, adult baptism or catechism, the true believer knows all scripture is God breathed. A Muslim fundamentalist would say the same about the Quran. So would an Orthodox Jew about the Old Testament and the Talmud. Let's try and put ourselves in the shoes of non-believers. How can you try to persuade them? Let's face it, missionaries must have this problem and they still manage to convert people. So how do they persuade non-believers to convert? They preach the word of God...they give people the gospel which is that man is born sinful and has no way to pay for his sins thereby being damned to hell, but the gospel, which is the death, burial and resurrection of Christ draws people to repentance...the Holy Spirit does the drawing of sinners to God....there is no person on the face of this earth that has ever sought God as that is contrary to our sinful nature. John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. www.gotquestions.org/drawn-salvation.html
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 0:37:40 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jan 25, 2017 0:37:40 GMT -5
Hi Chefmate51, To start off with, each person that is born is a diferent person and will die when the person's body is either worn out, because of an illness or by accident. As Jesus said, Elijah had already come again. Why should the Disciples think Jesus was talking about John the Baptist? It is evident to me that they knew that reincarnation existed. Now I will see if I can use your link. This conversation is finished on my end. I have given you scriptures but you choose to cling to a lie. Hi Chefmate, I can read.!!! And Jesus did say that Elijah HAD come AGAIN, and the Disciples did believe that Jesus meant John the Baptist. I'm not imagining what was said.!!! Coming again as another person definiely means reincarnation.!!! If you refuse to believe this then there is nothing I can do about that. I have been given proof that reincarnation exists by my own experiences. If you want to believe that they are all a lie, so be it.!!! May the Blessings Be.
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 1:04:33 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jan 25, 2017 1:04:33 GMT -5
Hi Chefmate51, It stands to reason if Jesus was seen and heard speaking with Moses and Elijah then he can't be sinless. As you said yourself, all the people committing any of the list of sins that you gave are committing a sin. Jesus was a man, if He was sinless as you say? Then he would not have been disobeying God, by speaking with the dead. It looks like Jesus disobeyed God then, so he could not have been so perfect. There is definitely something wrong with what has been written in the Bible.
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 1:44:45 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jan 25, 2017 1:44:45 GMT -5
Hi Chefmate51, You have quoted verses that contradicts what is happening. Strange things happen in life that are not ordinary happenings, like the shining figure that appeared in my lounge and saw quite clearly. According to you that is of Satan, yet when something strange happens when Jesus is involved, even though it is said that you cannot speak with the dead, you don't believe that is also of the Devil.Something is wrong somewhere!!! I will try to explain. Jesus was without sin which is why He was the only one who could pay our penalty and take the wrath of God that was meant for us: Revelation 21:8 “But cowards, unbelievers, the corrupt, murderers, the immoral, those who practice witchcraft, idol worshipers, and all liars–their fate is in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.” Galatians 5:19-21 Now the actions of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, promiscuity, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, rivalry, jealously, outbursts of anger, quarrels, conflicts, factions, envy, murder, drunkenness, wild partying, and things like that. I am telling you now, as I have told you in the past, that people who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. Now keep in mind, the perfection and sinlessness of Jesus. He could not be talking to two men that were reincarnated when His own word expressly forbids contacting spirits. God is incapable of lying or sinning. While this event took place, God the Father spoke these words... 'This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear him!' Again, God cannot lie and would not endorse reincarnation in any way, shape or form. Hi Chefmate51, If God cannot lie, then it couldn't have been God's voice that was heard, so that only leaves Satan, who must have been in deceiving mode again, tricking those who heard him. I have loved God since I was a child, so it looks like I must have been drawn by the Holy Spirit. I have always said that it is the Holy Spirit who leads us. Besides being drawn to God as a child I was also baptised as an adult, so must have been born again. Can that be undone?
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 6:21:01 GMT -5
Post by mouse on Jan 25, 2017 6:21:01 GMT -5
but how do you justify reincarnation when the bible specifically states: Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment Paul spoke many times of being with the Lord upon death....and many times Jesus spoke of hell that it is immediate upon death. IF reincarnation exists, why did Jesus not once speak of it? that should be your first clue it is not going to happen and I don't want to see you pass away with a belief that will damn you to hell. Hi Chefmate51, Jesus definitely said to his Disciples that Elijah had come again and the Disciples took that to be John the Baptist. If that isn't describing reincarnation what else could it be describing? no it isn't describing reincarnation at all.... you say the disciples took that to be John....the disciples TOOK to be John is a very iffy word to to base the idea of reincarnation on ..its not factual at all has absolutely no backup I think your getting away with the idea of reincarnation simply because you believe in it what probably happened was that John was very similar to Elijah so much so that comparrisons were drawn..it can happen how many times do we hear people say oh he/she is a chip off the old block when a family member is like another in looks and mannerisms..that doesn't mean to say theres a reincarnation eg my granddaughter is very much like me in temprement..voice and mannerisms and the image of one of my sisters in looks..its a family joke that she is me and my sisters reincarnation....but trust me there is no reincarnation at work..only genetics my Brother died before his Grandson was born..the babe is the image of him...reincarnation..nah again its genetics
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 8:14:23 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jan 25, 2017 8:14:23 GMT -5
Hi Mouse, have it your way, believe what you like. I've not only read what it said in the Bible, I have had experiences that match up with what Jesus said, so I'm not confused. You haven't had that kind of experience so as I said, believe what you like.
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 8:37:26 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jan 25, 2017 8:37:26 GMT -5
Hi Men an tol, It is not quite true what you said: that people can't see the future before it has happened. I saw written on the wall, 'Father,Time waits for no one' at the time I didn't realise what it meant. Shortly afterwards my ex husband turned up after arriving from Germany.He hadn't told me that he was coming, but there you are he was there.
I also saw a big branch break off one of the trees in my front garden, again a short time later it did in reality break off. It had rained heavily for days and the weight of the rain caused it to break off. I have had similar experiences and each time, it came to pass. The most recent being when I found myself out in space and saw the planet Earth shaking back and forth. Now I'm waiting to see what happens.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 9:09:38 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2017 9:09:38 GMT -5
Hi Chefmate51, It stands to reason if Jesus was seen and heard speaking with Moses and Elijah then he can't be sinless. As you said yourself, all the people committing any of the list of sins that you gave are committing a sin. Jesus was a man, if He was sinless as you say? Then he would not have been disobeying God, by speaking with the dead. It looks like Jesus disobeyed God then, so he could not have been so perfect. There is definitely something wrong with what has been written in the Bible.
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 16:51:09 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jan 25, 2017 16:51:09 GMT -5
Hi Chefmate51, It stands to reason if Jesus was seen and heard speaking with Moses and Elijah then he can't be sinless. As you said yourself, all the people committing any of the list of sins that you gave are committing a sin. Jesus was a man, if He was sinless as you say? Then he would not have been disobeying God, by speaking with the dead. It looks like Jesus disobeyed God then, so he could not have been so perfect. There is definitely something wrong with what has been written in the Bible. [img src="http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa116/chefmate5 1/bang-head.gif"]Hi Chefmate, Very clever.!!! I like it, but surely life can't be that bad. We shouldn't let ourselves go off the deep end when we are frustrated with something, we always have to be in control of our emotions so that we are always behaving in a civil and reasonable manner no matter what the circumstances. It is something that we all have to learn. IMO The world is in the state that it is in because of people letting it all hang out and behaving as they please. We are told to love our fellow sojourners on this planet, so we don't do anything deliberately to harm them. But it seems that there are so many people out there who love to hate, I can't for the life of me understand this kind of behaviour. May the Blessings Be.!!!
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 17:23:06 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jan 25, 2017 17:23:06 GMT -5
I agree salvation is not dependant on knowing any scripture, but, after one has had the regeneration by the Holy Spirit, born again, and not through infant baptism, adult baptism or catechism, the true believer knows all scripture is God breathed. A Muslim fundamentalist would say the same about the Quran. So would an Orthodox Jew about the Old Testament and the Talmud. Let's try and put ourselves in the shoes of non-believers. How can you try to persuade them? Let's face it, missionaries must have this problem and they still manage to convert people. So how do they persuade non-believers to convert? Hi LadyLinda, When the physical plane was created, so were the forces of positivity and negativity, this is what allows us the opportunity to make a choice. We are the ones that really choose whether the choice will be good or bad. So God is allowing us our say otherwise we would just be as robots and not proving the kind of person that we have turned out to be. In my many lifetimes on this Earth plane, the one thing that I have learned is: not to hate, I wish the best for everyone, so would not go out of my way to deliberately harm anyone. I do believe in the 10 commandments, which is a guide for all of us to follow. It is said in the Bible that God miraculously etched the commandments on tablets of stone, which I believe to be true.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 22:07:21 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2017 22:07:21 GMT -5
Hi Chefmate, Very clever.!!! I like it, but surely life can't be that bad. We shouldn't let ourselves go off the deep end when we are frustrated with something, we always have to be in control of our emotions so that we are always behaving in a civil and reasonable manner no matter what the circumstances. It is something that we all have to learn. IMO The world is in the state that it is in because of people letting it all hang out and behaving as they please. We are told to love our fellow sojourners on this planet, so we don't do anything deliberately to harm them. But it seems that there are so many people out there who love to hate, I can't for the life of me understand this kind of behaviour. May the Blessings Be.!!! you missed my point but I'll leave it at that.
|
|
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 23:12:06 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jan 25, 2017 23:12:06 GMT -5
Hi Chefmate51, There are too many inconsistities in the Bible, so if what is in there is supposedly God breathed, you are under a misapprehension of the true facts.IMO. We can leave it at that.!!! You did say that we would only be butting heads if we continued, and I agree with you.!!!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
SOUL
Jan 25, 2017 23:44:37 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2017 23:44:37 GMT -5
Hi Chefmate51, There are too many inconsistities in the Bible, so if what is in there is supposedly God breathed, you are under a misapprehension of the true facts.IMO. We can leave it at that.!!! You did say that we would only be butting heads if we continued, and I agree with you.!!! finally something we agree on!!
|
|