Titanic Error

[Deleted]

LONDON — The Titanic hit an iceberg in 1912 because of a basic steering error, and only sank as fast as it did because an official persuaded the captain to continue sailing, an author said in an interview published Wednesday.

Louise Patten, a writer and granddaughter of Titanic second officer Charles Lightoller, said the truth about what happened nearly 100 years ago had been hidden for fear of tarnishing the reputation of her grandfather, who later became a war hero.

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"They could easily have avoided the iceberg if it wasn't for the blunder," Patten told the Daily Telegraph.

"Instead of steering Titanic safely round to the left of the iceberg, once it had been spotted dead ahead, the steersman, Robert Hitchins, had panicked and turned it the wrong way."

Patten, who made the revelations to coincide with the publication of her new novel "Good as Gold" into which her account of events are woven, said that the conversion from sailing ships to steam meant there were two different steering systems.

Crucially, one system meant turning the wheel one way and the other in completely the opposite direction.

Once the mistake had been made, Patten added, "they only had four minutes to change course, and by the time (first officer William) Murdoch spotted Hitchins' mistake and then tried to rectify it, it was too late."

Most popular Titanic sunk by steering mistake, author says Updated 42 minutes ago Egg farm heads give Congress few answers Preemie dies on day of parents' funeral Preemie orphaned when parents die in crash New claim: Helmsman turned Titanic into iceberg Patten's grandfather was not on watch at the time of the collision, but he was present at a final meeting of the ship's officers before the Titanic went down.

There he heard not only about the fatal mistake but also the fact that J. Bruce Ismay — chairman of Titanic's owner, the White Star Line — persuaded the captain to continue sailing, sinking the ship hours faster than would otherwise have happened.

"If Titanic had stood still, she would have survived at least until the rescue ship came and no one need have died," Patten said.

The RMS Titanic was the world's biggest passenger liner when it left Southampton, England, for New York on its maiden voyage on April 10, 1912. Four days into the trip, the ship hit an iceberg and sank, taking more than 1,500 passengers with it.

[sadie]

Well.....possibly that might have worked.....but there is no way they could have know how large the iceberg was under the water.........so it still might not have worked.......

I don't understand why you would keep chugging along while water is pouring in to the side??? That seems absurd.......

[Erasmus]

Once you're hit miles from anywhere but you believe yourself unsinkable, what else would you do except hope to limp to the nearest port for repairs? It makes a certain kind of sense from that they knew then. They did send distress calls. The problem was not that it was not unsinkable after all, but that the life support was criminally inadequate.

[sadie]

Ahhh.....unsinkable.....so keep going......didn't think of it that way........tough way to prove that wrong.

[Erasmus]

Especially when you know you aren't carrying enough life support for the numbers aboard. I don't know why that was - something to do with cutting costs or delays in provision, and since it was unsinkable then they weren't really necessary were they?

[markindurham]

The story of 'Titanic' has many parts to it, and is a classic example of lots of small errors combining to cause a disaster.

The claim that she was 'unsinkable' is laughable now, but even then should have been picked up on. For example, a lot was made of the fact that she had lots of bulkheads - the problem was that they didn't go all the way to the deckhead above, so if one compartment did flood, once the water reached a certain level it overflowed to the next compartment...

The Radio Operators (NOT Officers - that accolade came as a consequence of their bravery in remaining at their posts until the ship sank, costing them their lives) were trying to get ice warnings, but commercial pressures (selling pre-arrival telegrams to passengers was big business) and the commercial traffic was deemed more important - this changed after the loss of 'Titanic'

The conmercial pressure on the Master, not helped by having the Company Chairman (Ismay) on board, to keep up speed in known icing conditions was critical

The lack of access to binoculars for the lookouts - the cupboard containing them was locked, & the key had been inadvertently removed from the ship by the Officer who left the ship at Queenstown - no spare was located

The lack of lifesaving equipment was a scandal - this led to the SOLAS (Safety of Life at Sea) regulations, which ensure that adequate lifesaving equipment is available for all on board, being introduced very quickly after the tragedy

The well-known helm error didn't help either

Oh, and the hull had become very brittle in the cold temperatures being experienced - remember, steel metallurgy was still in its infancy when 'Titanic' was built - no-one knew the consequences of certain high-carbon steels being subjected to shear stresses when in very cold conditions

As I say, lots of little things adding up to one big 'event'

[sadie]

Excellent post Mark......it was a series of things that went wrong.....it would be unfair to point the finger and one person or one single event.......just about everything went wrong there.........

[markindurham]

Hi Sadie

Thank you.

Yes, it was a 'chain of events'; wasn't the first, & certainly won't be the last

[sadie]

I think sometimes we get too big for our britches.....so to speak......begin to think we are "infallible" and these things happen just to show us how wrong we are.

[Erasmus]

Apart from the occasional meteorite strike, there hardly ever is on single reason why things go wrong. In a way, that is the reason they go wrong! Individual problems might be anticipated but their combination or the influence that one problem night have in changing conditions for another often is not recognised.

It is a thought that so much was made of Titanic's bulkheads (and I'll bet the reason they fell short was cost!) when they were a feature of Chinese junks from well before the year 1000, along with the rudder, magnetic compass and probably a complicated but effective method of measuring longitude by the stars (which I don't understand!). They even flooded the bow bulkhead to provide a stabilizing ballast. Clever folk those Chinese!

[markindurham]

Mm, it was more likely to trim the ship, Erasmus. The space forward of the foremost bulkhead & the bow is called the Forepeak - even today, if a ship is 'in ballast' ie with no cargo on board, or indeed only part loaded, it's oftentimes the case that the Forepeak is filled, in order to keep the bow of the ship down. Ships don't steer too well if they have too much stern trim (or indeed are 'down by the head' ).

There are many, many examples of old methods of seamanship still in use today

[gabriel]

Sept 22, 2010 17:38:03 GMT -5 @chefmate said:

LONDON — The Titanic hit an iceberg in 1912 because of a basic steering error, and only sank as fast as it did because an official persuaded the captain to continue sailing, an author said in an interview published Wednesday.

Louise Patten, a writer and granddaughter of Titanic second officer Charles Lightoller, said the truth about what happened nearly 100 years ago had been hidden for fear of tarnishing the reputation of her grandfather, who later became a war hero.

More science news from MSNBC Tech & Science
RMS Titanic Inc. How the Titanic tore apart
Based on newly made 3-D maps of the shipwreck site, experts say that the Titanic’s breakup was messier than previously thought.
Three 'lost' amphibians found Nature could have parted sea for Moses' escape Lightoller, the most senior officer to have survived the disaster, covered up the error in two inquiries on both sides of the Atlantic because he was worried it would bankrupt the ill-fated liner's owners and put his colleagues out of a job.

"They could easily have avoided the iceberg if it wasn't for the blunder," Patten told the Daily Telegraph.

"Instead of steering Titanic safely round to the left of the iceberg, once it had been spotted dead ahead, the steersman, Robert Hitchins, had panicked and turned it the wrong way."

Patten, who made the revelations to coincide with the publication of her new novel "Good as Gold" into which her account of events are woven, said that the conversion from sailing ships to steam meant there were two different steering systems.

Crucially, one system meant turning the wheel one way and the other in completely the opposite direction.

Once the mistake had been made, Patten added, "they only had four minutes to change course, and by the time (first officer William) Murdoch spotted Hitchins' mistake and then tried to rectify it, it was too late."

Most popular Titanic sunk by steering mistake, author says Updated 42 minutes ago Egg farm heads give Congress few answers Preemie dies on day of parents' funeral Preemie orphaned when parents die in crash New claim: Helmsman turned Titanic into iceberg Patten's grandfather was not on watch at the time of the collision, but he was present at a final meeting of the ship's officers before the Titanic went down.

There he heard not only about the fatal mistake but also the fact that J. Bruce Ismay — chairman of Titanic's owner, the White Star Line — persuaded the captain to continue sailing, sinking the ship hours faster than would otherwise have happened.

"If Titanic had stood still, she would have survived at least until the rescue ship came and no one need have died," Patten said.

The RMS Titanic was the world's biggest passenger liner when it left Southampton, England, for New York on its maiden voyage on April 10, 1912. Four days into the trip, the ship hit an iceberg and sank, taking more than 1,500 passengers with it.

Whoa chef. Where the hell did this come from?

OK. Hitchens was the quartermaster. He had no authority to turn the wheel anywhere except where he was ordered. Murdoch told him Hard Starboard while Murdoch signalled to the Engine Room full reverse.

Now the article is quite correct. Orders to turn were reversed then so a hard a starboard actually meant turn to port (left) which would have been away from the iceberg.

Lightoller was in his cabin when she hit the iceberg. He wasn't on the bridge, he wasn't even on deck until half an hour or so after the collision.

Then he was busy getting lifeboats under way and then busy trying to save his own life.

This is a load of cr**. Hitchens didn't steer the Titanic into anything. He was just following orders and Murdoch sure as hell didn't tell him to steer into the iceberg.

But..the point about the Titanic steering straight into the iceberg has been raised many times over the years. She probably would have survived if she'd hit bow on. Quite a few people would have been killed but not as many as when she sank.

But..would you have done that? Murdoch did what anyone would have done. Called for hard a starboard while cutting her engines. Problem was, a huge ship like the Titanic didn't just stop dead. Her trials outside Belfast found she stopped around about a mile after the propellers stopped.

There's also been a lot of talk about running her after she'd hit. But who knew then and who knows now? I wouldn't want to continue to run a ship that's been punctured.

Anyway. A year and a half and it's the anniversary of her sinking.

[markindurham]

Mm, given that the hull has been proved to have become brittle, as I mentioned before, it's possible that it might have broken more? We'll never know now, of course.

Oh, I believe that Lightoller was actually Third Officer at the time. Wasn't he the only Officer to survive? He was certainly the most senior to get off OK. Certainly no Engineers survived

[gabriel]

mark, if you're interested, there are many good sites available to read about the Titanic. The other thread on here about the Titanic has many interesting photos and articles. FYI.

Captain - EJ Smith

Chief Officer - Henry Wilde

1st Officer - William Murdoch

2nd Officer - Charles Lightoller

3rd Officer - Herbert Pitman

4th Officer - Joseph Boxhall

5th Officer - Harold Lowe

6th Officer - James Moody

Lightoller, Pitman, Boxhall and Lowe survived. All the others died.

I just watched again a vid last night about the integrity of the iron on the Titanic. It wasn't the quality we have today but it was fine by 1912 standards. The problem, I think, lay in the rivets used to keep the hull plates together. There was a lot of slag mixed in with the iron and that, combined with the intense cold water, was most likely the reason why the rivets gave way when she scraped the iceberg.

She only scraped a few feet along her starboard side but it was enough to pop the rivets and send water pouring into her. Where the rivets were is central to why the water came in. Her forward starboard side was punctured and she wasn't designed for that. She had watertight compartments but too many were hit for her to stay afloat.

Because of the lack of lifeboats, once she struck, 1500 people were doomed. Nothing was going to stop her from sinking and nothing was going to save those people.

[markindurham]

thanks, gabriel

I was sure that Lightoller was 3/O, but never mind..

I've actually got a bit of a 'professional interest' in Titanic - as some on here already know, I'm a seafarer myself, and it's amazing how much was changed after Titanic, as I mentioned before