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Post by beth on Oct 17, 2016 11:45:24 GMT -5
We have that problem, too. I notice it particularly around mid-sized cities. It seems to take about 2 decades from the time the sprawl begins (green space bought up and turned into shopping malls or tract housing), but after that, it accelerates. A shame. "You don't know what you've got til it's gone". Joni Mithell I think that you are correct Jessiealan. In fact, I am coming to believe that we have traveled far enough down this road of ‘developing’ that we may have passed a point of no return. However, that is too simplistic as an answer, rather we may have moved into incentives that provide that allow no other direction. My community (I believe) may be a good example. I suspect that we can agree that developers have provided the insight as to type and direction of development, with those developers having some vision, sort of like a small army comprised of many Frank Lloyd Wrights each holding some insight that we of more common vision do not understand except in the narrowed view of the rear view mirror. However, I am beginning to believe that such developers are no more exceptional (in terms of a vision) than any of us and, they are responding to far more mundane incentives provided by others with less insight than the rest of us. Here I speak of purely economic incentive with such programs as Clura (City Limits Urban Revitalization Area) and TIF (Tax Increment Financing). Such programs have no vision but rather simply bring economic incentives to developers who will build just to acquire these moneys. The original intent of such programs were to bring revitalization to blighted areas and use delayed taxation requirements to develop greater future property taxes coming into the city to relieve (in the future) tax pressures on property tax payers (primarily residential). But after more than 20 years these areas have increased in number and been expanded and extended father into the future with no property tax relief realized and blighted areas growing (today our abandoned houses have grown to nearly 500 from about 150 some 20 years ago. It seems the only benefit has been developers gaining control of easy to acquire funds and additional profits. These programs have been developed by State Legislatures and federal enactments applied through HUD, neither of which are known for developing visions of building. Moreover, most of these funds (taxes) seem to be applied to new unused lands rather than revitalizing current deteriorating-structure stock. The point here being that these programs are being defined and driven by governmental individuals not native to our communities, sort of a developing just to develop. Agreed. Another thing that makes me crazy is letting these big ghost boxes that used to be thriving stores (KMart, Food City, Macy's, several others) ... including entire rust belt manufacturing plants, stay there as eyesores while green space and rural acreage is being eaten up, little by little.
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Post by beth on Oct 17, 2016 11:55:29 GMT -5
bright morning ..going to a friends funeral this afternoon ..which will be unpleasant as several relatives have crawled out of the wood work.. 3rd and 4th cousins..like spectres at the feast theve come for the pickings.... having been no where for the last 80odd years suddenlythey appeared as long lost relatives who tried to make them selves indespencible ...money money money I hope you have someone to go with you, mouse. Not a great way to spend a lovely fall day. It's a very nice day here weather wise. A work day for me, but I'll be finished in a couple of hours. Last night my brother and family did the Sunday Supper and I took a couple of photos since they are still green (yard, trees, etc.), with flowers. Not all that unusual, but by this time we are seeing more fall color, most years. I think the last time we had summer blooms still going strong on Halloween was 4 or 5 years ago. I'll put up a picture in Gardening later today.
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Post by men an tol on Oct 17, 2016 12:12:22 GMT -5
I think that you are correct Jessiealan. In fact, I am coming to believe that we have traveled far enough down this road of ‘developing’ that we may have passed a point of no return. However, that is too simplistic as an answer, rather we may have moved into incentives that provide that allow no other direction. My community (I believe) may be a good example. I suspect that we can agree that developers have provided the insight as to type and direction of development, with those developers having some vision, sort of like a small army comprised of many Frank Lloyd Wrights each holding some insight that we of more common vision do not understand except in the narrowed view of the rear view mirror. However, I am beginning to believe that such developers are no more exceptional (in terms of a vision) than any of us and, they are responding to far more mundane incentives provided by others with less insight than the rest of us. Here I speak of purely economic incentive with such programs as Clura (City Limits Urban Revitalization Area) and TIF (Tax Increment Financing). Such programs have no vision but rather simply bring economic incentives to developers who will build just to acquire these moneys. The original intent of such programs were to bring revitalization to blighted areas and use delayed taxation requirements to develop greater future property taxes coming into the city to relieve (in the future) tax pressures on property tax payers (primarily residential). But after more than 20 years these areas have increased in number and been expanded and extended father into the future with no property tax relief realized and blighted areas growing (today our abandoned houses have grown to nearly 500 from about 150 some 20 years ago. It seems the only benefit has been developers gaining control of easy to acquire funds and additional profits. These programs have been developed by State Legislatures and federal enactments applied through HUD, neither of which are known for developing visions of building. Moreover, most of these funds (taxes) seem to be applied to new unused lands rather than revitalizing current deteriorating-structure stock. The point here being that these programs are being defined and driven by governmental individuals not native to our communities, sort of a developing just to develop. Agreed. Another thing that makes me crazy is letting these big ghost boxes that used to be thriving stores (KMart, Food City, Macy's, several others) ... including entire rust belt manufacturing plants, stay there as eyesores while green space and rural acreage is being eaten up, little by little. Quite right Beth, just look at Detroit. At one time one of the great Cities of the world. The manufacturing city where thousands came for work during the Great Depression and it became the arsenal of democracy. Now it is block after block of deteriorating structures. So bad that the city is considering tearing down what is left and just giving it as bare land back to the surrounding counties. Great vision there!!!! What a thrown away resource (that is land, buildings and people) that could be used as a resource for a resurgence of growth.
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Post by beth on Oct 17, 2016 22:29:02 GMT -5
Ha! If you haven't tried using the Halloween 2014 theme, give it a whirl. There's a small chance it might make you dizzy - if so go get something else. But, if you're not affected that way, give it a try while you're posting. lolololol Quite a ride.
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Post by mouse on Oct 18, 2016 4:35:59 GMT -5
yes daughter was with me and joint friends of course..the after the event gathering actually went well.. and we all agreed the departed would have enjoyed and that it all turned out well ... she finally departed to the song "" the day they invented champagne""" and we toasted her memory with a few bottles of the stuff
Tuesday wet cold and windy...nothing to do today two friends coming round later
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2016 10:40:20 GMT -5
Sunshine this morning after a few rainy days....going to library later today.
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Post by mouse on Oct 19, 2016 3:54:34 GMT -5
damp cold bright but not sunny the colours are rather lovely this autum..my Forsythia has turned a deep plumb red and the assa is firey red and orange...the oak is a dull rust colour a touch of frost and it will be beautiful
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Jessiealan
xr
Member of the Month, October 2013
Posts: 8,726
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Post by Jessiealan on Oct 19, 2016 11:50:40 GMT -5
damp cold bright but not sunny the colours are rather lovely this autum..my Forsythia has turned a deep plumb red and the assa is firey red and orange...the oak is a dull rust colour a touch of frost and it will be beautiful What a treat, mouse. We have good color this year, too, but it is just getting started. Our show should be in a week or so at the end of the month. I'll try to remember to get a picture for you. I'd like to also get a picture of one of the elaborately decorated houses at Halloween. With that, it is necessary to take the picrures at just the right time of day for the lights to be on but not too dark to see details. At dusk. Here is something for you and any other Putin fans. I am tempted to try to find one to buy and put on my kitchen wall for the comments it would draw. www.cnn.com/2016/10/19/europe/vladimir-putin-calendar-2017/index.htmlI expect it will probably become a world wide best seller.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 12:11:47 GMT -5
damp cold bright but not sunny the colours are rather lovely this autum..my Forsythia has turned a deep plumb red and the assa is firey red and orange...the oak is a dull rust colour a touch of frost and it will be beautiful What a treat, mouse. We have good color this year, too, but it is just getting started. Our show should be in a week or so at the end of the month. I'll try to remember to get a picture for you. I'd like to also get a picture of one of the elaborately decorated houses at Halloween. With that, it is necessary to take the picrures at just the right time of day for the lights to be on but not too dark to see details. At dusk. Here is something for you and any other Putin fans. I am tempted to try to find one to buy and put on my kitchen wall for the comments it would draw. www.cnn.com/2016/10/19/europe/vladimir-putin-calendar-2017/index.htmlI expect it will probably become a world wide best seller. I'll only purchase if there are shirtless pics. What a handsome devil!
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Post by mouse on Oct 19, 2016 12:13:23 GMT -5
am not a Putin fan..i just don't like him getting blamed for what he hasn't done...same would go for any one else they do enough things to blame them for...no need for add ons re the calendar..he does seem to fancy him self as an athletic come action guy..not my type though the photo I like best isn't on there..its where he is riding across the sttepes with just a tartar type waist coat on
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2016 14:19:17 GMT -5
Putin inspires more confidence as a leader than Obama
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josephdphillips
Global Facilitator
January 2015 Member of the Month
Posts: 3,494
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Post by josephdphillips on Oct 19, 2016 14:35:56 GMT -5
Putin inspires more confidence as a leader than Obama Because Putin is proud to be Russian, and doesn't have his finger in the air all the time. The Dark One is just plain disgusting.
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Post by men an tol on Oct 19, 2016 14:47:03 GMT -5
Putin inspires more confidence as a leader than Obama Because Putin is proud to be Russian, and doesn't have his finger in the air all the time. The Dark One is just plain disgusting. You’re right Joseph. As with other strong leaders, as long as he perceives that there is no resistance to what he does or says, he will continue to push the edge. On the other hand our (the US) leader continues to blow hot air that no one pays any attention to and grovel for approval from other world leaders. It is embarrassing at best. It is not looking that whoever is going to be the next president of the United States will be any better.
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Post by beth on Oct 19, 2016 16:20:08 GMT -5
Because Putin is proud to be Russian, and doesn't have his finger in the air all the time. The Dark One is just plain disgusting. You’re right Joseph. As with other strong leaders, as long as he perceives that there is no resistance to what he does or says, he will continue to push the edge. On the other hand our (the US) leader continues to blow hot air that no one pays any attention to and grovel for approval from other world leaders. It is embarrassing at best. It is not looking that whoever is going to be the next president of the United States will be any better. Aw .. do I detect defeat in your hearts and minds? What would your reaction be if Trump won? Mixed, I'll bet. Debate night. Not sure I'm going to watch. Burn out is near.
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Post by beth on Oct 19, 2016 16:22:26 GMT -5
yes daughter was with me and joint friends of course..the after the event gathering actually went well.. and we all agreed the departed would have enjoyed and that it all turned out well ... she finally departed to the song "" the day they invented champagne""" and we toasted her memory with a few bottles of the stuff Tuesday wet cold and windy...nothing to do today two friends coming round later I hope it turned out better than you thought. Nice day here, warm with blue sky and high, white, puffy clouds. Off (exceept for a few hours of homework) until Friday. Joy.
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