Haddon hall...one of the most beautiful of old houses

[mouse]

Sept 15, 2016 18:10:19 GMT -5 annaj26 said:

Lin, that has nothing to do with what I was talking about. I meant that, compared to today, women did not have modern conveniences to use for cooking and cleaning. Only the rich women could afford to hire this done for them. Feminism was not the point at all.

actually that's not quite true..it wasn't only the rich who could afford to have servants..its a common misconception that servants were only affordable by the rich...
the middle class used to have at least one servant quite often more than one ... as did shop owners and many of the working classes too would have a person working for them[thinking of those above labouring ..more blue collar but still defined as working class]
various writers of times past make it quite clear that having a servant or having servants cut across all classes
labour was cheap and affordable ..Mrs Gaskill...the Brontes even Dickens ..they mention servants working for the less than rich..even Agatha Christies Genteel but not rich Miss Marple has a girl and a woman wot does

back when I was a child it wasn't at all unusual for people far from wealthy to have live in or daily help..
and today we have cleaners or gardeners..they don't live in but are still employed in those servant roles even if its only by the day or a couple of hours,.,or we hire caterers for big occasions or carers for elderly relatives..
its still the buying of a service although the terms of reference have altered
society has changed as has needs..we don't need drivers as we have transport services or taxis..we don't need cooks as we can buy already prepared food
the more things change the more they stay the same

[annaj26]

Lots of people still have a one or two days a week person to help with household chores. My mom has had one as long as I've know her. All my life. I think Beth mentioned she has a weekly cleaning lady.

I still say life is easier for women now. We have nice bathrooms and kitchens. People back years ago did not. Even with servants, life with no refrigeration or running water must have been hard.

[Deleted]

Sept 16, 2016 4:00:41 GMT -5 Scottish Lassie said:

Sept 15, 2016 21:46:45 GMT -5 @chefmate51 said:

if you watch enough of these documentaries, it was brain numbing to be a rich lady....the rules of etiquette were strict while the female servants worked their fingers to the bone.

I am glad I wasn't alive.

Hi Chefmate51, As I believe in reincarnation, how do you know that you weren't around then. We have to resolve all the problems that we have with each other and therefore be free of all Karma before we reach the stage of not having to be reincarnated again and again.

I don't believe in reincarnation as it is a false teaching and not a Christian belief.

Hebrews 9:27 - And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.

I know I wasn't around because I place my faith in Jesus Christ not some sorry cult that mixes a little bit of truth with a truckload of deceit.

www.gotquestions.org/reincarnation.html

Knowing I am a Christian, why even ask that type question?

[apple]

It is a lovely place, so much history there!

[ladylinda]

Mouse is absolutely correct; it's a common mistake to believe that only the rich had servants.

(Or indeed that service was necessarily oppressive; on the whole, it wasn't - in fact, it was worse for the maid-of-all-work who worked as the only servant than for those who worked for larger families).

For too long the history of the past has been distorted by a mixture of Marxist and feminist propaganda.

I find it quite amazing at times to read a 'history' that is two-thirds propaganda rather than fact.

[Sysop3]

Nice rant, Lin. I guess you want another chance to grump around about your dislike of feminists. Go for it, it's your right. But, Annie didn't say anything like you're railing against.

Just sayin

[Scottish Lassie]

Sept 16, 2016 14:58:43 GMT -5 @chefmate51 said:

Sept 16, 2016 4:00:41 GMT -5 Scottish Lassie said:

Hi Chefmate51, As I believe in reincarnation, how do you know that you weren't around then. We have to resolve all the problems that we have with each other and therefore be free of all Karma before we reach the stage of not having to be reincarnated again and again.

I don't believe in reincarnation as it is a false teaching and not a Christian belief.

Hebrews 9:27 - And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.

I know I wasn't around because I place my faith in Jesus Christ not some sorry cult that mixes a little bit of truth with a truckload of deceit.

www.gotquestions.org/reincarnation.html

Knowing I am a Christian, why even ask that type question?

Hi Chefmate51, I say it as I see it. Each time Soul is reincarnated, it becomes a different person, so when that person dies, it is the ffirst and only time. Soul is still aware.

[Deleted]

I wonder if we tend to look at those bygone eras through rose tinted glasses and warm nostalgia?

[Deleted]

Sept 16, 2016 20:40:25 GMT -5 Scottish Lassie said:

Sept 16, 2016 14:58:43 GMT -5 @chefmate51 said:

I don't believe in reincarnation as it is a false teaching and not a Christian belief.

Hebrews 9:27 - And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.

I know I wasn't around because I place my faith in Jesus Christ not some sorry cult that mixes a little bit of truth with a truckload of deceit.

www.gotquestions.org/reincarnation.html

Knowing I am a Christian, why even ask that type question?

Hi Chefmate51, I say it as I see it. Each time Soul is reincarnated, it becomes a different person, so when that person dies, it is the ffirst and only time. Soul is still aware.

😕 - don't waste my time with your deceit.

[mouse]

Sept 16, 2016 21:07:27 GMT -5 @chefmate51 said:

I wonder if we tend to look at those bygone eras through rose tinted glasses and warm nostalgia?

only if you have absolutely no knowledge of the times...things are usually not ALL bad and not ALL good
but a mix of the two
plus never look at yesterday with todays norms..or you will have a very slanted view of past times

[mouse]

Sept 16, 2016 18:08:50 GMT -5 ladylinda said:

Mouse is absolutely correct; it's a common mistake to believe that only the rich had servants.

(Or indeed that service was necessarily oppressive; on the whole, it wasn't - in fact, it was worse for the maid-of-all-work who worked as the only servant than for those who worked for larger families).

For too long the history of the past has been distorted by a mixture of Marxist and feminist propaganda.

I find it quite amazing at times to read a 'history' that is two-thirds propaganda rather than fact.

well we both know our histories and of course history has to be looked at with a dispastionate eye...not comparing the past with to day.
I absolutely agree the maid of all work was the worst job in the world...but there again its not all encompassing good and bad employers and good and bad employees..to try to present the past as one set of people all bad and one set of people all good is just silly and bears no reality to the vagaries of the average human being employer or employee
and I agree fully that history has and is very distorted to suit propaganda at times
which is why I prefer noted historians who love their work and write about it quite unemotionally loving the subject without trying to send out some political or social message or using it to score points etc etc

[mouse]

Sept 16, 2016 12:14:21 GMT -5 annaj26 said:

Lots of people still have a one or two days a week person to help with household chores. My mom has had one as long as I've know her. All my life. I think Beth mentioned she has a weekly cleaning lady.

I still say life is easier for women now. We have nice bathrooms and kitchens. People back years ago did not. Even with servants, life with no refrigeration or running water must have been hard.

yes at long last it is easier for women
I could live without refrigeration..using old methods to keep foods plus of course the big houses would have ice houses..and the smaller houses would buy ice from ice sellers
at home we didn't have a fridg but we had a cold larder[stone lined with stone shelves and wooden shelves and we had cellars with cold slabs etc can cold shelves and cupboards..it was quite normal to have cellars.. modern homes of course do not
and back then there was no such thing as a weekly shop...
when the children were small I had a woman come in to do the general cleaning and some ironing[she also used to bring her bottle of sherry in her bag as well] she was an absolute hoot..insisted on calling me the missus and my husband the master..regardless of how many times we told her to call us by our names..but I never called her anything but Mrs Lucas
....poor old thing she eventually wrecked her liver
and actually she was a lot younger than I thought she was

[annaj26]

That's funny, mouse. The big question is, did she do a good job helping you with the housework? I asked my mom about that the other day. She doesn't have that personal a relationship with her cleaning helper, who does the weekly things, while mom and dad take care of the daily chores.When I start working full time, I'll have a once a week, too.

Women back then in the old days may not have realized they were having it hard, but compared with now, they were, of course.

The biggest disadvantages, to me, had to be no running water, refrigeration or modern transportation with good roads.

No supermarkets would be hard for me to manage, too. It takes time to rummage through a bunch of smaller stores.

[ladylinda]

Sept 17, 2016 15:10:27 GMT -5 annaj26 said:

That's funny, mouse. The big question is, did she do a good job helping you with the housework? I asked my mom about that the other day. She doesn't have that personal a relationship with her cleaning helper, who does the weekly things, while mom and dad take care of the daily chores.When I start working full time, I'll have a once a week, too.

Women back then in the old days may not have realized they were having it hard, but compared with now, they were, of course.

The biggest disadvantages, to me, had to be no running water, refrigeration or modern transportation with good roads.

No supermarkets would be hard for me to manage, too. It takes time to rummage through a bunch of smaller stores.

Well, the Romanies have been able to function like that for centuries, Anna.

It all depends what you get used to.

I quite enjoy roughing it and I definitely prefer the country (where there are less facilities than in London) to the cities.

[beth]

Sept 17, 2016 15:59:02 GMT -5 ladylinda said:

Sept 17, 2016 15:10:27 GMT -5 annaj26 said:

That's funny, mouse. The big question is, did she do a good job helping you with the housework? I asked my mom about that the other day. She doesn't have that personal a relationship with her cleaning helper, who does the weekly things, while mom and dad take care of the daily chores.When I start working full time, I'll have a once a week, too.

Women back then in the old days may not have realized they were having it hard, but compared with now, they were, of course.

The biggest disadvantages, to me, had to be no running water, refrigeration or modern transportation with good roads.

No supermarkets would be hard for me to manage, too. It takes time to rummage through a bunch of smaller stores.

Well, the Romanies have been able to function like that for centuries, Anna.

It all depends what you get used to.

I quite enjoy roughing it and I definitely prefer the country (where there are less facilities than in London) to the cities.

I'm sure there are points in favor of both life styles, Lin, but try working full time and needing time left over to spend with the kids and husband, and keeping the house up to spec. I don't blame Annie for planning to have a little help.