josephdphillips
Global Facilitator
January 2015 Member of the Month
Posts: 3,494
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Post by josephdphillips on Jul 31, 2016 19:40:42 GMT -5
Do you really think "we the people" deserve no better than Hillary or Trump? No, I don't. Personally, I don't think I .. or my family ... have done anything to deserve either of them. So write in someone else. Anyone with a conscience would, right? Your savoir faire attitude toward Trump seems particularly misplaced to me. I hope you don't have cause to regret not holding him up to higher standards. I'm not sure savoir faire is what you meant. I'm nonchalant about Trump because he's the right man at the right time. His political views expressed thus far are irrelevant. He's shrewd, cunning, ruthless, politically incorrect -- exactly what people want in a chief executive right now. I won't kneel to kiss his ring, but I like him.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2016 19:41:24 GMT -5
yes I do....funny thing is with Hillary no one has to lie or stretch the truth Good grief, how do you know? Some kind of extra sensory perception? I've watched her for 20+ years
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Post by beth on Jul 31, 2016 23:34:36 GMT -5
I'm not sure savoir faire is what you meant. I'm nonchalant about Trump because he's the right man at the right time. His political views expressed thus far are irrelevant. He's shrewd, cunning, ruthless, politically incorrect -- exactly what people want in a chief executive right now. I won't kneel to kiss his ring, but I like him. Oh I think it is, meaning you speak of him with grace and civility. I simply do not think he's worth it. I'd like to think he's capable but have doubts. He's kind of like a side show barker ... mostly a salesman and his single product is himself. Everything else, even his family, makes up the packaging. I wonder whether he's anymore incompetent than G.W.. Surely not. Bush was like a big, overgrown kid. But, look how much worse off we were when he left office than when he went in. The Republican establishment is still squeaking and jumping around each time he mis-speaks. Many still do not support him. Would you really want Mike Pence as President if anything happened to Trump. I'm looking for a bright side to that but so far .... nil No, not going to do a write in. May as well stay home as do that. I'll vote for one or the other. Not sure which yet, but at this point Hillary seems the lesser evil, if only because she understands the office.
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Post by beth on Jul 31, 2016 23:37:48 GMT -5
Good grief, how do you know? Some kind of extra sensory perception? I've watched her for 20+ years But, surely, that just amounts to what you've been told by the media.
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Post by Sysop3 on Aug 1, 2016 2:25:32 GMT -5
If you think she lies more than Trump, I think you're way off base. From past postings I will say that I am not surprised at your assertion Sysop3. Certainly I see Donald Trump as exaggerations of his positions and of the directions he states he will go. Secretary Clinton however, is a life time of lies and a record of disregarding her governmental duties when holding a position within government. She also demonstrates doing things behind closed doors and (in my opinion) she has no idea (at least doesn’t care about) following Constitutional structure to get what she wants. We may find that Donald Trump will be a version of the same thing. We may find that he is simply a very shallow person, however, there is real evidence of directions of Secretary Clinton will go, with Donald Trump it is still mostly supposition. Remember, these are the only options that we have. Following her career from White Water to today, it has been a steady stream of lies and disregarding the Constitution and her Oath of Office. I understand that you do not agree with my positions on this, but whether she is elected or not, I believe that we will all find that what I suggest will be proven to all to be true. The times we are moving into are too important to the survival of the West to allow a known liar to have control. The only thing that will protect us is if the Congress really takes control as they are supposed to do. I'd be willing to bet that, on an even scale, Trump lies as much or more. There are fact check lists that itemize his lies, there for anybody to double check.
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Post by men an tol on Aug 1, 2016 6:59:06 GMT -5
From past postings I will say that I am not surprised at your assertion Sysop3. Certainly I see Donald Trump as exaggerations of his positions and of the directions he states he will go. Secretary Clinton however, is a life time of lies and a record of disregarding her governmental duties when holding a position within government. She also demonstrates doing things behind closed doors and (in my opinion) she has no idea (at least doesn’t care about) following Constitutional structure to get what she wants. We may find that Donald Trump will be a version of the same thing. We may find that he is simply a very shallow person, however, there is real evidence of directions of Secretary Clinton will go, with Donald Trump it is still mostly supposition. Remember, these are the only options that we have. Following her career from White Water to today, it has been a steady stream of lies and disregarding the Constitution and her Oath of Office. I understand that you do not agree with my positions on this, but whether she is elected or not, I believe that we will all find that what I suggest will be proven to all to be true. The times we are moving into are too important to the survival of the West to allow a known liar to have control. The only thing that will protect us is if the Congress really takes control as they are supposed to do. I'd be willing to bet that, on an even scale, Trump lies as much or more. There are fact check lists that itemize his lies, there for anybody to double check. Yes, what you state is true and more is the pity that these are the only two we have to deal with, even so, we (as the voters) have to make a decision between these two. Making such decisions will be based on what we (individually) believe to be most important (obviously). For me such things are based in the candidate’s adherence to the Constitution and to their Oath of Office (concepts not important to many in today’s world). While we can say that in these areas Donald Trump is an unknown, Secretary Clinton has a life history of (not just the lies) but demonstrating that she cares nothing for either the Constitution nor her Oath of Office. There are also the indirect impacts on making such decisions. I believe that the leaderships of both major parties have demonstrated over time a disregard for the American people and the Constitution and their Oaths of Office. So I am suspicious of their directions and in that context, such party leadership mostly supports Secretary Clinton and dislikes Donald Trump. Most importantly is the future nominations for the Supreme Court. Clearly we can (at best) only guess at what these two will do, but in the list of possibilities that Donald Trump has offered these are people who primarily support the Constitution and not some political beliefs, and for me that is a major plus. Secretary Clinton is (as she has described herself) a Progressive-Liberal and that would most likely result in such nominations as Ruth Bader-Ginsburg. Such nominations would affectively swing the court decisions away from Constitutional support. So even if she were sincere in her approach to government (and I do not believe that she is) such selections would destroy the court. However, I have no confidence in her supporting the military in the need to rebuild of it. We are facing a very demanding and dangerous world and the diminishing (during President Obama’s terms of office) of military preparedness, has placed our country in a very dangerous position. The 7 naval fleets must be brought back into full power and, (in my opinion) 2 more fleets must be included. Our fleets of planes must be repair so that repairs are not dependent on robbing from one plane to fix another. As I have stated in the past, I am no fan of Donald Trump but with Secretary Clinton we have before us one of the least qualified people to ever be President.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2016 10:33:39 GMT -5
Ain't that the truth. The governed get what they deserve. No more. No less. That politicians or candidates lie doesn't concern me. That's their job, to tell voters what they want to hear. I'm more concerned with executive qualities, and Trump has them. The Vagina doesn't. Give me a break, Joseph. Do you really think "we the people" deserve no better than Hillary or Trump? Personally, I don't think I .. or my family ... have done anything to deserve either of them. Your savoir faire attitude toward Trump seems particularly misplaced to me. I hope you don't have cause to regret not holding him up to higher standards. I agree with Joseph but from a spiritual perspective...America has turned away from God and we are getting our judgement....this is a very immoral nation where the people are boastful of their sins...it's sickening
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2016 10:36:43 GMT -5
I've watched her for 20+ years But, surely, that just amounts to what you've been told by the media. I don't work for her nor am I privy to her private life, so media is all I have. I can't buy into the media has lied about her for decades and she's just been misunderstood. Open your eyes to what this woman really is behind the facade.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2016 11:25:18 GMT -5
What I am suggesting is that the Congress, The President, the Supreme Court, simply follow the Constitution and their Oath of Office. That they do not do so is our fault. That is, the fault of the people to make sure they do so. Ain't that the truth. The governed get what they deserve. No more. No less. That politicians or candidates lie doesn't concern me. That's their job, to tell voters what they want to hear. I'm more concerned with executive qualities, and Trump has them. The Vagina doesn't. Really, Joseph, even by your low standards of 'argument' that is a thoroughly despicable slur. Referring to Hillary Clinton as 'The Vagina' is simply condemning her because of her gender. I regard both her and Trump as being particularly unsuitable to occupy high office but it has nothing to do with their gender. Would you regard referring to Trump as The Penis as being some kind of sufficient reason for his disqualification? Please try and maintain some sense of connection with reality.
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josephdphillips
Global Facilitator
January 2015 Member of the Month
Posts: 3,494
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Post by josephdphillips on Aug 1, 2016 11:30:09 GMT -5
that is a thoroughly despicable slur. Referring to Hillary Clinton as 'The Vagina' is simply condemning her because of her gender. She is banking on her vagina to get her elected. It's central to her campaign. I referred to BHO as The Dark One, for similar reasons. Would you regard referring to Trump as The Penis as being some kind of sufficient reason for his disqualification? I don't think his sex is central to his campaign. Not that it would bother him, or me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2016 12:42:07 GMT -5
that is a thoroughly despicable slur. Referring to Hillary Clinton as 'The Vagina' is simply condemning her because of her gender. She is banking on her vagina to get her elected. It's central to her campaign. I referred to BHO as The Dark One, for similar reasons. Would you regard referring to Trump as The Penis as being some kind of sufficient reason for his disqualification? I don't think his sex is central to his campaign. Not that it would bother him, or me. Joeseph, you nailed it right on her vagina....people are so blinded they will vote for her for that reason just like the people who thought a black man would be a great idea for a president except they choose the wrong black man.
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Post by men an tol on Aug 1, 2016 13:46:34 GMT -5
To follow the Constitution does not mean walking in lockstep. Rather, following the rather few requirements of delegated functions for those elected. They do not have to ‘give up’ their self-interest to do so. Rather, within that congress, they work to achieve their self-interest by finding ways to work with others. Compromise many call it today but it in truth is a compromise based on self-interest.
Those who cannot find a way to compromise and maintain their self-interest and those who will demand that all others must follow their self-interest, will eventually fall by the wayside. However, it is singularly important that they find this road to compromise, this road of working for their self-interest within the rules of how government is to work within the Constitution.
If they only try to achieve their self-interest by controlling all others to bend to their will, then the Constitution is torn and we as a people lose no matter what they do. Part of this is for the people to demand an elected person who is virtuous. That is, honest and following their Oath of Office (and through that the Constitution). That is the Common Ground on which we all must walk. To do otherwise means that the only thing left is the grasping for power.
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Chelonian
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For she shall judge you...!
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Post by Chelonian on Aug 1, 2016 13:54:20 GMT -5
If you think she lies more than Trump, I think you're way off base. Actually she doesn't. Politifact independently assesses the truthfulness of each of major politician in the US since 2007.
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Chelonian
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For she shall judge you...!
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Post by Chelonian on Aug 1, 2016 14:01:11 GMT -5
Must be horrible to have a medical procedure funded by the taxpayer 'eh? You'd be buggered if you lived in the UK then. We actually don't mind paying for everyone to have access to medical services. After all, nobody knows when they might need medical services regardless of what it is. A persons beliefs should not come before progress.
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Post by Soulman on Aug 1, 2016 14:02:26 GMT -5
Ain't that the truth. The governed get what they deserve. No more. No less. That politicians or candidates lie doesn't concern me. That's their job, to tell voters what they want to hear. I'm more concerned with executive qualities, and Trump has them. The Vagina doesn't. Give me a break, Joseph. Do you really think "we the people" deserve no better than Hillary or Trump? Personally, I don't think I .. or my family ... have done anything to deserve either of them. Your savoir faire attitude toward Trump seems particularly misplaced to me. I hope you don't have cause to regret not holding him up to higher standards. As i have stated before, i read the posts re USA affairs but do not give an opinion. Let's face it after our recent referendum etc we are in busy waters ourselves. I would like to say that after living through quite a few different Presidents, several different campaigns, to me this one looks like you have two very dodgy characters.
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