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Post by markindurham on Mar 27, 2015 20:29:08 GMT -5
Hi Markindurham, when I gave my viewpoint there was no evidence as to why the tragedy had happened, so my first thought was that it was a terrorist act as that is all that is in the news at the moment. Apart from it being accidental, that was what I thought it must be. Even though it appears that this fellow is or was mentally ill, it is hard for me to believe that the act was not intentional but because of fanaticism. This seems to be what is spurring on all these people who are committing such acts. If this man was behaving in a logical manner at the time, a normal rational person would not have taken the lives of so many people. Can you behave in a rational manner and still be mad enough to do something like that? It beats me, that's all I can say. Assumption is, as the saying goes, the mother of all cock-ups...
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Post by kronks on Mar 28, 2015 0:28:50 GMT -5
Hi Markindurham, when I gave my viewpoint there was no evidence as to why the tragedy had happened, so my first thought was that it was a terrorist act as that is all that is in the news at the moment. Apart from it being accidental, that was what I thought it must be. Even though it appears that this fellow is or was mentally ill, it is hard for me to believe that the act was not intentional but because of fanaticism. This seems to be what is spurring on all these people who are committing such acts. If this man was behaving in a logical manner at the time, a normal rational person would not have taken the lives of so many people. Can you behave in a rational manner and still be mad enough to do something like that? It beats me, that's all I can say. I read something that he might be on some sort of medication, I read "Chemist close to his home confirms he regularly picked up medication but cannot confirm what it was to treat", but I think it is quite likely to be antidepressants, I have seen no mentionof any other medical condition. Trouble is so much is being kept secret from us, the investigators must know what he was taking but they won't say. They don't like to give out any information at all, which I think is wrong. Anyway when you look at some of the massacres caused by people on antidepressants it is shocking!! www.naturalnews.com/049137_Germanwings_depression_antidepressant_drugs.htmlSo I would not at all be surprised is if was in anti-depressants particularly SSRI's, but unfortunately the investigators will not tell us anything. Hopefully someone will leak what drugs he was taking, it seems that is the only way we will find out.
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Post by kronks on Mar 28, 2015 0:32:09 GMT -5
Hi Markindurham, when I gave my viewpoint there was no evidence as to why the tragedy had happened, so my first thought was that it was a terrorist act as that is all that is in the news at the moment. Apart from it being accidental, that was what I thought it must be. Even though it appears that this fellow is or was mentally ill, it is hard for me to believe that the act was not intentional but because of fanaticism. This seems to be what is spurring on all these people who are committing such acts. If this man was behaving in a logical manner at the time, a normal rational person would not have taken the lives of so many people. Can you behave in a rational manner and still be mad enough to do something like that? It beats me, that's all I can say. Assumption is, as the saying goes, the mother of all cock-ups... If it was a terror attack they would probably cover it up anyway, I doubt it in this case, but I would not be surprised if he was taking anti-depressants linked with suicide and mass murder. The drug companies would pay a lot of money to keep such information secret, gotta keep the profits up!!
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Post by markindurham on Mar 28, 2015 1:31:38 GMT -5
Assumption is, as the saying goes, the mother of all cock-ups... If it was a terror attack they would probably cover it up anyway, I doubt it in this case, but I would not be surprised if he was taking anti-depressants linked with suicide and mass murder. The drug companies would pay a lot of money to keep such information secret, gotta keep the profits up!! Sorry, but that now sounds like paranoia, chris. As for anti-depressants & their links - that's already a well-known connection...
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Post by Scottish Lassie on Mar 28, 2015 3:43:57 GMT -5
Hi Markindurham, when I gave my viewpoint there was no evidence as to why the tragedy had happened, so my first thought was that it was a terrorist act as that is all that is in the news at the moment. Apart from it being accidental, that was what I thought it must be. Even though it appears that this fellow is or was mentally ill, it is hard for me to believe that the act was not intentional but because of fanaticism. This seems to be what is spurring on all these people who are committing such acts. If this man was behaving in a logical manner at the time, a normal rational person would not have taken the lives of so many people. Can you behave in a rational manner and still be mad enough to do something like that? It beats me, that's all I can say. Assumption is, as the saying goes, the mother of all cock-ups... Maybe so Markindurham, but so what!!! am I being given the 3rd degree? It's only a discussion,with each person giving out what is on their mind, and that is all I have done. I'm not on Jury Duty!!! This fellow is still a terrorist as he has wantonly taken the lives of over 150 people. He was cool, calm and collected and knew exactly what he was doing, so don't try and say otherwise. He knew perfectly well that what he intended to do was wrong, but still went ahead and did it. It really wouldn't surprise me if someone didn't influence him to commit this crime, and may not have anything at all to do with the fact that he was in a depressed state.
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Post by mouse on Mar 28, 2015 4:08:52 GMT -5
Assumption is, as the saying goes, the mother of all cock-ups... Maybe so Markindurham, but so what!!! am I being given the 3rd degree? It's only a discussion,with each person giving out what is on their mind, and that is all I have done. I'm not on Jury Duty!!! This fellow is still a terrorist as he has wantonly taken the lives of over 150 people. He was cool, calm and collected and knew exactly what he was doing, so don't try and say otherwise. He knew perfectly well that what he intended to do was wrong, but still went ahead and did it. It really wouldn't surprise me if someone didn't influence him to commit this crime, and may not have anything at all to do with the fact that he was in a depressed state. no third degree Chris..just other opinions..as you say its a discussion Chris said..""""This fellow is still a terrorist as he has wantonly taken the lives of over 150 people. He was cool, calm and collected and knew exactly what he was doing, so don't try and say otherwise."" I don't think we can label him terrorist in that it seems doubtful his aim was to terrorise...he was most certainly selfish and self centered on his own demons..and a murderer... he appears to have had relasionship problems..could well have been on some sort of medication/drug and his employers knew to some extent of his problems....so blame if we go down the blame route is wide spread...but its not terrorism linked to political aims but these thing happen...these things happen all the time..we human beings cannot cover every possible mindset/angst etc etc we cannot guard against every sad or sick mind....and we cannot place blame every time either....and there isn't a reason for every action...some times people do what they will do...simply because they can..simply because the opportunity arises my sympathies are with those on the plane..and all the dreams and hopes and lives brought short... """"If it was a terror attack they would probably cover it up anyway,"""" nah..every terror attack brings in an opportunity for yet more draconian action...it suits the agenda to have terrorist attacks....it would suit no agenda least of all the business agenda to make it a terror attack...... I forget how much 9/11 cost the aviation business.....
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Post by Scottish Lassie on Mar 28, 2015 4:16:15 GMT -5
If it was a terror attack they would probably cover it up anyway, I doubt it in this case, but I would not be surprised if he was taking anti-depressants linked with suicide and mass murder. The drug companies would pay a lot of money to keep such information secret, gotta keep the profits up!! Sorry, but that now sounds like paranoia, chris. As for anti-depressants & their links - that's already a well-known connection... Hi Markindurham, I follow the news, and this is what has been happening someone is getting to vulnerable people and persuading them to commit acts such as that, so it could quite possibly have happened to him as well, who's to say? I'm just putting forward possibilities, why would you think that is paranoia. His reason for doing it will never be known, because he is not here to tell us what he was thinking at the time he committed the terrorist act. Please define a terrorist act for me seeing you know so much, then we might understand better as far as I am concerned everyone is just presenting theories, they will never know to sure. Kronks has also stated a possibility which might just be the case. seeing what has been happening because of these drugs. The best theory yet!!!
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Post by markindurham on Mar 28, 2015 4:17:10 GMT -5
Assumption is, as the saying goes, the mother of all cock-ups... Maybe so Markindurham, but so what!!! am I being given the 3rd degree? It's only a discussion,with each person giving out what is on their mind, and that is all I have done. I'm not on Jury Duty!!! This fellow is still a terrorist as he has wantonly taken the lives of over 150 people. He was cool, calm and collected and knew exactly what he was doing, so don't try and say otherwise. He knew perfectly well that what he intended to do was wrong, but still went ahead and did it. It really wouldn't surprise me if someone didn't influence him to commit this crime, and may not have anything at all to do with the fact that he was in a depressed state. Well now, it seems to me that you're very good at pontificating about your own beliefs, but you don't like to be challenged about them. A good example; yesterday Joseph challenged me regarding, inter alia, remotely operated aircraft and the use of ships as WMDs. I was able, without any animosity on my part, to rationally point out the reasoning for my stance on both, which were well received and, I believe, accepted without any problem on Joseph's part. There is NO evidence to suggest that this young pilot was in any way religiously or politically motivated to do what he did, although I do note that one or two Tea Party pillocks have tried to start a rumour that he was a recent convert to the cult of the carpet-headbutters... I don't believe that anybody is disputing, basis the evidence produced thus far, that he acted anything other than in a cool, calm and methodical manner. I'm really not sure why you feel it necessary to claim otherwise? Incidentally, how do you KNOW that he knew what he was doing was wrong? I'm sure that I'm not the only one wondering that...
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Post by fretslider on Mar 28, 2015 4:19:36 GMT -5
My own take is to go with the evidence. The evidence points towards a deliberate descent. Answering the question why he did it is speculative at best.
A deeply disturbed individual or a heartless lunatic, either way its shown up the flaws in cockpit security post 9/11.
I heard that now most airline operators will implement the two man on the cockpit rule. The naysayers hold that this will mean the door being open longer and increasing risk.
I'd say that's better than leaving a solitary pilot in control.
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Post by markindurham on Mar 28, 2015 4:26:18 GMT -5
Sorry, but that now sounds like paranoia, chris. As for anti-depressants & their links - that's already a well-known connection... Hi Markindurham, I follow the news, and this is what has been happening someone is getting to vulnerable people and persuading them to commit acts such as that, so it could quite possibly have happened to him as well, who's to say? I'm just putting forward possibilities, why would you think that is paranoia. His reason for doing it will never be known, because he is not here to tell us what he was thinking at the time he committed the terrorist act. Please define a terrorist act for me seeing you know so much, then we might understand better as far as I am concerned everyone is just presenting theories, they will never know to sure. Kronks has also stated a possibility which might just be the case. seeing what has been happening because of these drugs. The best theory yet!!! Why would the authorities try to cover up a terrorist act? These days it's nigh on impossible to do so, and the embarrassment when the truth is revealed is potentially powerful enough to topple governments. The definition of a terrorist act is to attempt to further one's political and/or religious aims by violence or the threat of violence against other people. So, what political or religious aim was this man working towards? There were no public threats made; no suicide note has been found. Indeed, no group has come forward to claim responsibility. Ergo, whilst it was indeed an act of violence, it was NOT a terrorist act. QED.
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Post by markindurham on Mar 28, 2015 4:33:34 GMT -5
My own take is to go with the evidence. The evidence points towards a deliberate descent. Answering the question why he did it is speculative at best. A deeply disturbed individual or a heartless lunatic, either way its shown up the flaws in cockpit security post 9/11. I heard that now most airline operators will implement the two man on the cockpit rule. The naysayers hold that this will mean the door being open longer and increasing risk. I'd say that's better than leaving a solitary pilot in control. Except that you now open the possibility of a rogue member of the Cabin Crew taking advantage of access to the Flight Deck if opportunity arises... Being discussed at length by the professionals on the PPruNe site. I think that the scary thing is that it's ENSA now dictating that this be done, whereas the CAA were happy for individual airlines to set their own procedures. Never good when the politicians get involved; particularly regarding security matters such as this. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3014474/EasyJet-Virgin-Atlantic-making-planes-vulnerable-terror-attacks-knee-jerk-new-safety-measures-wake-Germanwings-tragedy-say-air-safety-experts.htmlI really hope that this knee-jerk reaction doesn't turn round & bite them in the @r$e...
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Post by Scottish Lassie on Mar 28, 2015 4:53:27 GMT -5
Maybe so Markindurham, but so what!!! am I being given the 3rd degree? It's only a discussion,with each person giving out what is on their mind, and that is all I have done. I'm not on Jury Duty!!! This fellow is still a terrorist as he has wantonly taken the lives of over 150 people. He was cool, calm and collected and knew exactly what he was doing, so don't try and say otherwise. He knew perfectly well that what he intended to do was wrong, but still went ahead and did it. It really wouldn't surprise me if someone didn't influence him to commit this crime, and may not have anything at all to do with the fact that he was in a depressed state. no third degree Chris..just other opinions..as you say its a discussion Chris said..""""This fellow is still a terrorist as he has wantonly taken the lives of over 150 people. He was cool, calm and collected and knew exactly what he was doing, so don't try and say otherwise."" I don't think we can label him terrorist in that it seems doubtful his aim was to terrorise...he was most certainly selfish and self centered on his own demons..and a murderer... he appears to have had relasionship problems..could well have been on some sort of medication/drug and his employers knew to some extent of his problems....so blame if we go down the blame route is wide spread...but its not terrorism linked to political aims but these thing happen...these things happen all the time..we human beings cannot cover every possible mindset/angst etc etc we cannot guard against every sad or sick mind....and we cannot place blame every time either....and there isn't a reason for every action...some times people do what they will do...simply because they can..simply because the opportunity arises my sympathies are with those on the plane..and all the dreams and hopes and lives brought short... """"If it was a terror attack they would probably cover it up anyway,"""" nah..every terror attack brings in an opportunity for yet more draconian action...it suits the agenda to have terrorist attacks....it would suit no agenda least of all the business agenda to make it a terror attack...... I forget how much 9/11 cost the aviation business..... Hi Mouse, ofcourse there is a reason for everything, though we mightn't know what it is, sometimes we can only guess at what it may be, but there is a reason for every action. When someone strikes fear into a person, then the perpetrator is a terrorist. These passengers suffered at the hands of the co-pilot when they realised what was about to happen.
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Post by fretslider on Mar 28, 2015 5:05:39 GMT -5
My own take is to go with the evidence. The evidence points towards a deliberate descent. Answering the question why he did it is speculative at best. A deeply disturbed individual or a heartless lunatic, either way its shown up the flaws in cockpit security post 9/11. I heard that now most airline operators will implement the two man on the cockpit rule. The naysayers hold that this will mean the door being open longer and increasing risk. I'd say that's better than leaving a solitary pilot in control. Except that you now open the possibility of a rogue member of the Cabin Crew taking advantage of access to the Flight Deck if opportunity arises... Being discussed at length by the professionals on the PPruNe site. I think that the scary thing is that it's ENSA now dictating that this be done, whereas the CAA were happy for individual airlines to set their own procedures. Never good when the politicians get involved; particularly regarding security matters such as this. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3014474/EasyJet-Virgin-Atlantic-making-planes-vulnerable-terror-attacks-knee-jerk-new-safety-measures-wake-Germanwings-tragedy-say-air-safety-experts.htmlI really hope that this knee-jerk reaction doesn't turn round & bite them in the @r$e... Politicians are bound to skip thinking it through. BA's statement was interesting - "We don't discuss it"
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Post by markindurham on Mar 28, 2015 5:12:20 GMT -5
no third degree Chris..just other opinions..as you say its a discussion Chris said..""""This fellow is still a terrorist as he has wantonly taken the lives of over 150 people. He was cool, calm and collected and knew exactly what he was doing, so don't try and say otherwise."" I don't think we can label him terrorist in that it seems doubtful his aim was to terrorise...he was most certainly selfish and self centered on his own demons..and a murderer... he appears to have had relasionship problems..could well have been on some sort of medication/drug and his employers knew to some extent of his problems....so blame if we go down the blame route is wide spread...but its not terrorism linked to political aims but these thing happen...these things happen all the time..we human beings cannot cover every possible mindset/angst etc etc we cannot guard against every sad or sick mind....and we cannot place blame every time either....and there isn't a reason for every action...some times people do what they will do...simply because they can..simply because the opportunity arises my sympathies are with those on the plane..and all the dreams and hopes and lives brought short... """"If it was a terror attack they would probably cover it up anyway,"""" nah..every terror attack brings in an opportunity for yet more draconian action...it suits the agenda to have terrorist attacks....it would suit no agenda least of all the business agenda to make it a terror attack...... I forget how much 9/11 cost the aviation business..... Hi Mouse, ofcourse there is a reason for everything, though we mightn't know what it is, sometimes we can only guess at what it may be, but there is a reason for every action. When someone strikes fear into a person, then the perpetrator is a terrorist. These passengers suffered at the hands of the co-pilot when they realised what was about to happen. Not according to the definition - otherwise we could all, in theory, be regarded as terrorists. No doubt we all scared our parents by doing something daft at one point or another whilst small, for one thing... ...although some regimes would LOVE to be able to 'label' us all as such; the better to control us - for our own safety, natch...
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Post by Scottish Lassie on Mar 28, 2015 5:13:17 GMT -5
Maybe so Markindurham, but so what!!! am I being given the 3rd degree? It's only a discussion,with each person giving out what is on their mind, and that is all I have done. I'm not on Jury Duty!!! This fellow is still a terrorist as he has wantonly taken the lives of over 150 people. He was cool, calm and collected and knew exactly what he was doing, so don't try and say otherwise. He knew perfectly well that what he intended to do was wrong, but still went ahead and did it. It really wouldn't surprise me if someone didn't influence him to commit this crime, and may not have anything at all to do with the fact that he was in a depressed state. Well now, it seems to me that you're very good at pontificating about your own beliefs, but you don't like to be challenged about them. A good example; yesterday Joseph challenged me regarding, inter alia, remotely operated aircraft and the use of ships as WMDs. I was able, without any animosity on my part, to rationally point out the reasoning for my stance on both, which were well received and, I believe, accepted without any problem on Joseph's part. There is NO evidence to suggest that this young pilot was in any way religiously or politically motivated to do what he did, although I do note that one or two Tea Party pillocks have tried to start a rumour that he was a recent convert to the cult of the carpet-headbutters... I don't believe that anybody is disputing, basis the evidence produced thus far, that he acted anything other than in a cool, calm and methodical manner. I'm really not sure why you feel it necessary to claim otherwise? Incidentally, how do you KNOW that he knew what he was doing was wrong? I'm sure that I'm not the only one wondering that... We are all expounding what we believe is the reason for his action, why has it turned personal all of a sudden? I'm only surmising as everyone else is doing, if we find out that he was prescribed the drugs that Kronks mentioned, then I'll go for that, as that is the best reason yet. We will just have to wait for more evidence, otherwise we will never really know what was on his mind no matter how much we pontificate!!!
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